Spiritual Evolution: Love’s Role in Conscious Growth! With Gary Zukav

0:00

We were a five sensory species, and we evolved by pursuing external power. Now we are becoming a multisensory species. We are evolving by growing spiritually. The distinction between love and fear is the fundamental duality in the earth school. That's where we're living, a domain of time and space and matter. Every time you make a decision, you are choosing to act or not act from either love or fear, and if you don't know what your intention is, that means it's unconscious.

0:43

Hey guys, if you enjoyed this video and want my episodes delivered straight to your mailbox every week and to receive my free meditation where you get to meet your future self, then head over to wisdomfromnorth.com/futureself. Hello, Gary, a warm welcome to the show.

1:03

Thank you. It's, it's good to be here.

1:07

I'm truly, truly excited about speaking with you today, like ever since I started Wisdom From North back in 2012 I knew of your name like you, I feel like you've been there forever sharing wisdom to probably hundreds of 1000s of maybe million people around the world, like you're a best selling author, especially of the book the seat of the soul. You've been on Oprah Winfrey many times. She adores you, and she's one of my role models. And you have so much wisdom to share, and I'm super excited to delve into thoughts about your perspectives, about what's going on on the planet right now, the shift of consciousness. However, before we go there, I'm always curious to learn how people get into the spiritual path. Like today, you're this amazing spiritual teacher, but I assume that you didn't like go to university, thinking I'm going to become a spiritual teacher one day. So I'd love to hear your story. What happened?

2:13

That's a big question. It's a big question for everyone. I grew up in the Midwestern part of the United States. It's a Kansas is the state that I grew up in and in a small town, and I didn't have any special talents that I knew of at the time, but I did get a scholarship to Harvard, and no one, very few in this little town had ever gone to Harvard, just one that I knew of. So I decided to go. And I graduated from there after taking a year off to see Europe. I really wanted to see outside of the United States. And then when I came back, I I graduated from Harvard and enlisted in the Army, and at that time, I enlisted in a branch of the army called the Green Berets, and I went to Vietnam. I volunteered. I wanted to go because I was so insecure that I needed to feel I was admirable, or I wouldn't have used the term, but it would actually be lovable. And I was in Vietnam, and when I returned, I decided that I wanted to go to California because I'd never seen it, and I felt exciting things about it, so I went and I lived there for 13 years in San Francisco, which I liked a lot. And during that time, I got invited to meet some physicists at the Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, which was a US government, federally funded laboratory, high energy particle physics laboratory just above the University of California at Berkeley campus. And I went, and I was so interested in what I heard there, there were about 12 physicists, I didn't realize how renowned they were at the time, and they were asking themselves the question, are we creating the reality that we're experimenting with? And I had had just that kind of conversation in North Beach, which is a part of San Francisco where I lived, and these physicists were not having a coffee shop conversation. They were seriously just discussing the nature of reality as as as they were inquiring. So I got so excited about what I heard, I started reading some. Books, physics books, to understand why I was so excited, but I couldn't share what was exciting me. And as I did, I asked if I could return to this meeting. I asked the organizer, Elizabeth Rauscher, who's also a physicist, if I could. And she agreed, and I started to write a book. I'd never written a book before. I never liked science. I'd never taken a science course, but I wanted to share what I was learning about quantum physics with liberal arts majors like me, and I did, and it was published, and it was called the dancing wooly masters, and it won an award. It won the American Book Award for science, and after that, people expected me to write a sequel, like a sequel to the dancing wooly masters, about another cutting edge branch of science, like maybe genetics. But instead, I had discovered non physical reality, and I discovered it writing this book about physics, I started writing with an outline for the book and then an outline for each chapter, but when I wrote, when I actually wrote, none of that applied. It wasn't interesting anymore, and so I just discarded it, and I started to write what was interesting, and that became the dancing wooly masters. And while I was writing that, I noticed that, after I had thrown away all of the outlines, the chapters nonetheless seem to be emerging, as though they were designed to fit together. But I didn't do that, and that's when I realized that I'm not writing this book alone. That is not possible to be alone. That was a long time ago, that was in the mid 70s, but non physical reality has been a part of my experience. And now I've discovered that, or I have been taught in the process, that there is a new consciousness that is emerging in the entire human species, very fast, within a few human generations, and I discovered this, or was taught this in the late 80s. Well, half of those three human generations have arrived. They're the millennials and jet Z, and it's no longer news that a new consciousness is emerging. The new consciousness Janica is here, and there are more people who have the old consciousness than the new. But that's changing. The old consciousness, by the way, is limited to the perceptions of the five senses, what can be seen and touched and tasted and heard and smelled, and the understanding of power from that consciousness is the ability to manipulate and control. The new consciousness is not limited to the five senses, and its understanding of power is the ability to distinguish within yourself between love and fear and choose love no matter what's going on inside of yourself or what's going on outside of yourself, or another way to say it is the new consciousness is alignment of your personality with your Soul with real power. That's authentic power. And now there are still more people that have the old consciousness than the new but within another generation and a half, that will change, and everyone will be multi sensory, but not necessarily authentically powerful. That's the potential of the new consciousness, and you have to create that consciously. And that's what all of the books and the courses and the events that Linda Francis, my spiritual partner, and I have created, is about creating authentic power. How you do it? Because no one else can do it for you, no course, no book, none of the things that we've created, but they can support you in creating authentic power yourself, and that, I believe, is probably what brought us together. As you mentioned, you've read the books or some of the books, and I still love sharing these things, and also I love sharing where the new consciousness is taking us initially, I could explain that it's multi sensory perception replacing five sensory perception. But even as we are becoming multi sensory, we are not but we are becoming many of us, hundreds of millions of us. We. So there is yet another consciousness that is calling to us, and that's the universal human. So I wrote a book about that too. It's called universal human, and it was published a few years ago in 21 and I love sharing the new consciousness that is a part of my consciousness now and that within generations or so, will be a part of everyone's consciousness, and this is a good time for me to share with you and with your audience, that what I'm sharing with you, I do not suggest or ask you to accept as true just because I say it. On the contrary, I suggest the opposite, that if you resonate with anything that I say, that you experiment with it. You take it into your life and see what you create with it. And if you like what you create, experiment some more. That's what you have a life force to experiment with it. And if I don't say anything that resonates with you. Well, let it go. Don't try to wear a shoe that pinches. So that's where we are. Now, I love talking about consciousness, because mine's changing, and yours is changing. And I love talking about the new human species that's emerging. And I love talking about these things, because everyone now, whether they are multi sensory or not, knows something big is happening. And if they're millennial or Gen Z, they don't know it's the new consciousness, because they're born with it. For them, it's just human consciousness. But they they want to know why the world is disintegrating, why the world that they know is falling apart, and what can be done about it, and why the things that used to be able to fix it in the past only make the situation worse now. So these are the things that I'm looking forward to discussing with you, if that's what you're interested in, and sharing them with with our listeners.

12:05

Thank you so much for sharing. It's a paradox, in a way, because in one way, I feel things are changing in myself and in with people I communicate with that have this focus, and in another way, when I look at the news, I feel like nothing is changing and it's getting more polarized. And even worse,

12:29

I hear what you're saying, but nothing to me looks like it's changing. Everything's becoming more polarized, and nothing's working. That is the change, Jannecke, it's right in front of your nose. It's in front of 7 billion people's noses. Why is there now polarization throughout the world? Why is competition at its keenest? Why is there a great divide everywhere? Why is cooperation so difficult to attain? Why do we have such harsh opinions of other people? This is the change. We are in the middle of the most exciting transformation in human consciousness. We have one foot in the old consciousness and one foot in the new.The The question that everyone who has some awareness is asking, Why is this happening in my country? Now, there's always been political division, but never has there been such harsh, unrelenting, unforgiving political division. Never have we had such a conservative candidate for the President that he has no comparison in our history. He has comparisons in European history, and they're all brutal and painful. Why is this happening now? And it's been happening in Germany. It's happening all over the world. And the question is, what is this change? So first of all, you don't have to have somebody point it out, although I'm glad to do that, Janica, this is the change. You've just identified it, and you say it's not happening in you. You don't have the new consciousness. Well, you invited me onto your program, didn't you? If you were in the old consciousness, that would not have happened. And I can say that with confidence, not because individuals who are multi sensory are any better or superior to those that are five sensory, they're simply a little farther along in an evolutionary ebb and flow. But those who are still five sensory have nothing in their experience that. To help them relate to what I'm describing. It's just not there. And so for them, they would dismiss it. If they are frightened, they would dismiss it impolitely and rudely. If they are polite or respectful, they would say, well, that's interesting, but it's not what I feel, but everyone sees that the world is in some way that's important to them disintegrating. It's becoming non functional. All of our social structures are becoming non functional on the way to disintegration. Education, governance, we talked about, we're just talking about that, commerce, healthcare, all of them, all of our social structures are based on the old understanding of power, which is ability to manipulate and control, that is external power. And all of our social structures are not only based on external power. They teach, they share, they explain, external power, external power. Oh, this is one thing I forgot to mention earlier, and it's very important, as the new consciousness emerges, which it is now, external power becomes more than obsolete. It becomes destructive, it becomes counterproductive to our evolution. And it used to be good medicine. It used to be necessary for us to to evolve. We were a five sensory species, and we evolved by pursuing external power. Now we are becoming a multi sensory species. We are evolving by growing spiritually, and we are growing spiritually by creating authentic power. The distinction between love and fear is the fundamental duality in the earth school. That's where we're living, a domain of time and space and matter and duality, and the fundamental duality is love and fear. Every time you make a decision, you are choosing to act or not act from either love or fear, and if you don't know what your intention is that means it's unconscious. You are creating unconsciously with an intention that you're unaware of. And if the intention that you're creating with comes from love, you will be creating constructive, good, feeling, healthy, loving consequences in your life. And if you are creating with fear, you'll be creating the opposite, destructive, unhealthy, painful consequences in your life. Now, if you don't know what your intention is, it's fear. Every intention that is unconscious comes from fear. So this is the way that most people are living their lives, and they're in a lot of pain.

18:28

Is it sort of the pain gets so strong that that calls us to make other choices? Is that the reason why things are polarized so we could see the shadow that's a lot of spiritual teachers speak about that, that it has to come up so we can look at it and then let it go. Is that the reason, from your perspective, that the polarization is happening

18:50

something like that. No, that's not why the polarization is happening. The polarization and the destruction of that world and the old world order that we know is not happening because of the shadow. The shadow is a term that Carl Jung created, probably in the late 1890s and it's still a valid term. It just means those parts of ourselves that are too painful or shameful for us to recognize in ourselves, we won't recognize on ourselves, and instead, we project them outward onto other people, and we don't like it when we see it, and we blame the other people and we judge them. That is a projection that has been going on as long as there's been a consciousness that we can recognize as human the way we know it. I am talking about a brand new human species, and it's happening in Scandinavia. It's happening in rice fields in Southeast Asia. It's happening in India. It's happening in industrialized countries like Japan and the United States and the EU it's happening. Happening everywhere. It's happening in South America and Central America, and this is what is causing all of our social structures to become non functional. And if you know what's happening, you know you can understand it more easily that you have inherited this world from a five sensory species. It created this world, not you, but you're living in it. Now what are you going to do? It'll help you to understand this world, to understand that it was created by a five sensory species. It was created by a consciousness that's dead, that's dying. It still exists in the world powerfully, but it has no future. It's it's like an old fashioned steam locomotive that's thundering down the track, and it's the symbol in its day of all that's good, but now it's out of coal. It's out of steam, there's no fire in its belly, and it's coming to a halt. That's what's happening, and that's what I love to discuss.

21:09

Yeah, to help this process, you said that we need to co create it like we actually need to take some action on it.

21:20

No, not quite. You don't need to co create this new consciousness. This is a gift from the universe. All you have to do is unwrap it, and it's there. It emerges. It's emerging in hundreds of millions of us now with this new consciousness, multi sensory consciousness comes a new potential of power, and that is authentic power that you have to create, not co create. You cannot co create authentic power. There's only one person in the world that can create authentic power for you, and that's you, because there's only one person in the world who knows your intentions or can become aware of your intentions, and that's you. There's only one person in the world who can consciously decide to recognize when fear is active in you and when love is active in you and choose to act or speak from love and not from fear, and there's no judgment. The universe doesn't judge. It doesn't say, Janica, if you do this, you're going to go to heaven, and Janica, if you don't, you're in trouble. You're going to hell. The universe doesn't look in terms of reward and punishment or good and bad. It looks at it in terms more of cause and effect. Every cause has an effect, and if you participate in the cause, you will participate in the effect. In the east, this is called karma.

23:03

I guess I'm saying co create, because from a duality point of view, I feel like I'm me, and then we have source. And in another perspective,

23:15

let's look at that for a minute. Let's look at that for a minute. Because you said something interesting. You said you feel that you feel there, that you are yourself, and there's we, and we are source. What is source? The way you're using it?

23:30

Well, God, the universe, spirits, all there is. You know that that thing we cannot name that we don't know what is, but it's all there.

23:41

You can not name it, but you can know it. You can't experience it. Now, I agree with you, with all those things you just said, is source separate from anything? Is the universe separate from anything?

23:58

I don't think it is, but the illusion on schoolroom Earth,

24:04

it feels like it. Jannecke, I agree with you again, the universe is not separate from anything. What could it be separate from? Since the universe is not separate from anything, including you and including me, that means that we're not different. That means that we are one. Now these are things that we could think about. Now we can begin to experience them in the old consciousness, five sensory perception, there is an uncrossable barrier inside us, between inside and outside. It's unclimbable. You can't get to the other side. There's you and what's happening inside you, and there's the world. And from this consciousness, it's impossible to UN. Understand how inner transformation can bring about outer transformation. The best that people can think is, well, if you grow spiritually yourself, maybe you'll affect other people, and you will reach a one of us will be the 100th monkey, and then all of us will start being kinder and wiser. In my experience, it's not that simple at all. It's much more powerful, complex, far reaching and present right now, in the new consciousness, multi sensory perception, this distinction between in here and out there does not exist. That means you begin to experience that you are not different from others. You do choose, moment by moment, how you will act and with what intention, whether you're choosing unconsciously or consciously, a five century human cannot understand what I just said and about there being no distinction in the new consciousness between in here and out there. So the old human would say, that's nonsense, scary from the five century perspective, it is literally nonsense. Not one of the five senses can ever experience that, but you can experience that, and countless of us are now beginning to experience things like that and more. And so I want to suggest to you and to our listeners that this change in consciousness is more than simply recognizing a new human awareness that is not confined to the five senses, and that now, as we become multisensory, we begin to sense something beyond that, call it universal Human, and beyond that is the end of the experience that we call human. All of that is in motion now, all of that, it will take another one or two generations for us to be multi sensory, to come back and look at this podcast and say, My gosh, yeah, that's that. That's the way I that's that's the way my children are doing it. That's how I'm doing it. This, this is Gary had something there. Gary didn't have anything. This all comes from the universe. I'm not the creator of it. Neither is Linda, but we were so excited and empowered to look at it, and more than look at it, to experiment with it, to create authentic power is not easy. It's simple to understand. You learn how to recognize in yourself the difference between love and fear, and you do that through emotional awareness. That's one of the tools of creating authentic power. And then you decide if you're going to act from fear when it's active in you, or speak from it, because you know that if you do, you're going to create consequences that are painful. You can choose to do whatever you want, or you can choose to act from love to make a responsible choice that's another tool of creating authentic power. A responsible choice is a choice that creates consequences for which you are willing to assume responsibility that's it. That's it. There's only two tools, three tools. The third tool is consulting intuition. The rest of it is a matter of practice. I've been practicing it since I discovered it, because I didn't just take it for granted, because this is what I was learning, and I have changed myself from an insecure needing to prove to Myself, addicted to sex, emotionally violent young man who cared nothing, had no ability to care for anyone, thought only of himself into who I am now, and I'm different now. So I know that creating authentic power is a potential that is a real one, and authentic power is not some non attainable goal that is waiting for you in a in a distant future. Don't wait for a future. Janetka, there is no such thing you make your decisions now, always you are making a decision. Now you cannot make a decision. Decision in the future, you can only make it now, and that's when you do.

30:06

I get 1000s of questions. I'll take the last one I've dropped into my mind that I've been curious about after interviewing so many amazing spiritual teachers. Is there sort of a and I know this is completely the wrong word, but of lack of words, the goal, the intention from the from God, from the universe, that we're going to surrender on the schoolroom earth, to the will of the universe. Because I am part of the universe, and if I just surrender, I will let God live through me.

30:42

You cannot surrender to God, which is surrendering to love while you are in a frightened part of your personality. You cannot do it while you hate someone. You cannot do it while you're jealous, while you're resentful, while you're competitive. You cannot do it while you want to kill someone, you cannot do it while you want to kill yourself. This is the work. This is the work. There is a will, you might say there's always a will of a consciousness higher than your own, a wisdom that's higher than your own. And part of creating authentic power is to accept that as your will. That is a choice. Chanica, it's not something you were born to do use you were implying, I think, that the purpose of a life in the earth school is to surrender to love. In my experience, that's close surrender to love. To love, that's your curriculum in the earth school to love, your curriculum involves all of your experiences, our interactions between us form the substance of our spiritual growth. We find some people attractive and some people repulsive. We see people and they appear differently. Some are male and some are female, white, brown, yellow. Some are European, some are Arabic. All of these things are characteristics of a personality. A personality is that part of you that was born on a certain day and will die on a certain day? What happens between those two days is your life. You are more than a personality. Five sensory humans identify themselves with their personalities. They don't think that they are anything more or experiencing or experience. Pardon me, themselves as more than bodies and minds. A multi sensory human experiences himself or herself as a soul. A multi sensory human knows that he or she has an immortal aspect, an aspect that was that existed before they were born and that will exist after they die. A multi sensory human identifies with its soul and a universal human that we're feeling the call to now, a universal human will emerge from authentically powerful multi sensory humans and a universal human identifies with life with a capital, l, from my experience, the words universe with a capital U, consciousness with a capital, C, Life with a capital. L, love with a capital L. These are all the same thing. They're what you're calling divinity, love, God. But God, you're thinking, Well, I was brought up in a Christian country. I'm not Christian, but the United States is strongly Christian, and from that perspective, God is a male. Number one, he's old. Number two, he's unpredictable. Number three, he's vindictive. Number four, you cannot tamper with this presence. He will suffer. You will suffer if you do. Does that remind you of anything?

34:48

Yeah, the guy who sits on a cloud,

34:51

this one, doesn't sit in a cloud. He sits in heaven, whether it's in Greek mythology and he's hurling thunderbolts. He's not a lovable or a. Living person. In other words, the Bible that I don't know much about, but I know it's got an Old Testament and a New Testament, and both of them have the same begin, the same way that God created us, in His image, his image, his image. He this older guy with a white beard that you don't mess with. That's our image, Janica. Look around you and you'll see this everywhere we live in mate in patriarchal societies, and the patriarch, if you're lucky, can be kind if you're not, that's the God that we create in our mind. Well, first of all, how do we know it's a he? So I say that when you look at source, which is a beautiful word, or divinity or God, I try not to use God because it's been preempted. You might say it's been claimed, but in my experience, there is no religion that is the same as the universal truth at its foundation. So this religion is another social structure that's disintegrating. And you can see that everywhere, not only if it's Catholicism or Christianity, but Buddhism, Hinduism, Baha'i, the very attraction of religion, as opposed to spirituality, is diminishing.

36:44

I do. I do feel that. I see that, especially on YouTube, where I hang out a lot, because I've been on YouTube ever since 2012 and at that time, there weren't that many speaking about near death experiences or out of body experiences or lucid dreaming, and not so many were channeling. And there were a few spiritual teachers like yourself and all the famous ones like Greg Braden and Bruce Lipton. And now there are so many people having mystical experiences, having all these these channeling abilities. People are like, I'm actually contradicting myself here, because

37:26

You are, you are. This is the change identifying it. This is the change that is happening to us now. It's big, it's everywhere, and it is going to be in everyone within another generation and a half, this is the change. Thank you for defining that in terms of YouTube. YouTube defines nothing. YouTube reflects what people who watch it put onto it.

37:53

Yes, now you did point out, and we spoke a little bit about it, like doing the practice that you practice that you came from another mindset when you were young and you met your wonderful, beloved Linda, and then things changed, but you also practiced. But I'm wondering about when

38:18

I wasn't young. She was 45

38:23

okay, okay, but was there a part where you felt that you awakened, that there was a grace coming, or was it all hard work? And what I'm curious about is that in order to step it into this authentic power, you said that it will emerge, but at the same time, we have to practice, and that's where I'm

38:47

sorry. But when I say no, I don't mean that's wrong. I mean I wish to clarify what I am saying. First of all, spiritual teacher. And you named a few people that you consider spiritual teachers. We're not the same, and we're not born equal, and that just means that our perceptions, our understandings, are different. That's why I suggest that you're not saying take anything that I'm saying is so because I say it, I'd say, Listen to Greg, listen to Bruce, listen to Deepak, listen to Eckhart, listen to Neal Donald Walsch, listen to them. And apply the same suggestions. If you hear anything that you resonate with, experiment with it. Take it into your life. And if it produces what you want. Do it again, and if it doesn't let it go, all of these people I'm mentioning have valuable ways of looking at the world, just as every meditation can be valuable, whether it's staring at a can. Or chanting OM or listening to a psalm, or Vipassana or Tibetan, they're all powerful modalities. Use them if they help you to become loving, if they help you to become more compassionate, starting with yourself. You can't start with someone else. By the way, you cannot be compassionate with someone else until you can become compassionate with yourself. That's why it's so difficult to become compassionate with others, because you're looking in the wrong place. You're looking at where you are not compassionate. But you can't change that in someone else by looking at someone else, the change that changes the world is in you. And if you don't make it, you don't change, and your world doesn't change. And that's not a punishment, and it's not a criticism. It is simply the effect of a cause. You are the cause. You are the cause that gives you tremendous In other words, what you are is a creative and compassionate, loving and powerful spirit, and you are responsible for everything that you create. And you create everything in your life. There is nothing within you that you cannot change, and everything is within you.

41:50

All right, so my mind is still back to, how do I change?

41:56

Well, let's, let's go back there. Then you change by creating authentic power. The first

42:04

what is authentic power? Like? I get it from my mind that, okay, I'm I'm being authentic. I'm being like, aligned with my true authentic.

42:13

What is it authentic to? What I mean? Make sure. Start by making sure that your mind understands what I'm saying or what Eckert or Deepak is saying. This is where everyone starts with a mind. No one starts with this consciousness. Some do, some do. But if you want to create authentic power, which means to become loving consciously, you can't simply say I'm going to be loving. Oh, I'm going to be loving. Yes, I'm going to have crystals all over and crucifixes all over. And here's dancing Shiva, and here's Vishnu, all of these icons, they fill up my life. But you are not going to be loving until you do the work on yourself. These things can remind you of some of that work. The first step is emotional awareness, whenever you think that you might be whenever you feel emotional pain, let's just start there. Put your attention inside yourself, not outside you. The illusion in the earth school, if you put it this way, is that the world is the cause of your pain, and therefore, to eliminate your pain, you need to change the world. That's the illusion. You can never eliminate your pain by changing the world, because what happens in the world does not cause it. The World activates dynamics inside you, and those inner dynamics in you create the painful physical sensations and judgmental thoughts that you experience. So the first step in creating authentic power is to develop emotional awareness. Linda and I wrote a book about this. It's called the heart of the soul emotional awareness. So when you're when you're feeling emotional pain, take your attention off the outside world. That is a perception that was that satisfies, that satisfies five sensory humans, because they feel that they can eliminate their pain by changing the world a multi sensory human knows that cannot change anything inside themselves, that what lies behind your eyes is far more powerful than what lies in front of them. So turn your attention inward and put them into these areas in your body, your throat, area, your. Chest area and your solar plexus area, and look for physical sensations in your body. And by physical sensations, I don't mean happy, sad, depressed, lonely. I mean aching, throbbing, stabbing, stinging, turning, burning, contracting, expanding, physical sensations, first look in your chest, because that's usually an easy place to experience your emotions when you're not used to this, and see what physical sensations you're experiencing. Then put your attention in your solar plexus, that's the area just below your sternum, just below your chest area and do the same, and then put your attention in your throat. Area you might find there's a constriction in your throat about the size of a ping pong ball in the middle of your throat, in your chest area, there might be a stinging in the upper right or a contraction across your entire chest, when you can begin to articulate your emotions in this way, you are becoming emotionally literate. This is emotional awareness. Until then, you are emotionally illiterate. You do not know what's happening in your body, but what's happening in your body will show you powerful dynamics that are creating your experiences moment by moment. In this case, it's fear. When you can look inside these same areas and you find blissful, good feeling, physical sensations, the kind you want to have more of, then you know you're in a loving part of your personality, and if you act on that, you will create beneficial and constructive consequences. In other words, to create love, you need to identify and experientially feel every part of your personality that prevents you from loving and move beyond its control, and as you do, you move into love. The loving parts of your personality are those that you experience as as gratitude, appreciation, caring, contentment, patience, all of the universe. These are the parts of your personality that are already aligned with your soul. When you're experiencing these things, Janica, you are experiencing your soul that's authentic power. Now the question is, how do you make that into an ongoing, stabilized experience in your life that is the creation of authentic power, and this is how you do it. You develop emotional awareness, and you see what physical sensations are occurring in these parts of your body. In the east, these are called chakras, and there's seven of them. And when you recognize pain, then you make a responsible choice. You move, use your volition to move your attention into a part of your personality that's loving, into a time when you were loving and loved and you knew it, you know it, and then choose to act or speak from that part of your personality, instead of the frightened part that is creating authentic power, that is the moment of creating authentic power. And as you do that again and again, you begin to move beyond the control of the frightened part of your personality, as you choose to act from a loving part of your personality while you are experiencing the painful physical sensations of a frightened part that is the moment that you begin to create mastery. In that moment, your life may not change in a way that you see it, but as you do that again and again, you begin to move beyond the control of that frightened part of your personality. This is creating authentic power. You cannot stumble upon it. You cannot fall into it. You cannot step into it. You cannot be given it by anyone else. You must create it, choice by choice, decision by decision, of love instead of fear. Does this answer your question?

49:31

Yes, what I take out from that, from what I understand and I know that I'm very in my mind, like I'm structured that way that I always like use my mind sort of to understand, but that is that we have a choice, like it's available for us. It's coming, you said, the universe, like it's we cannot stop it. It's emerging. But it's also a choice that I have to make.

50:00

No, that is not the choice the new. You're confusing the new consciousness with the choice of love or fear. The new consciousness the new and by the way, I use my mind too. I wrote a book on quantum physics. I love using my mind. It's one of my fun things to do, so that is not a bad thing in itself. But don't think that your mind is going to take you any place that's important in your life. Only your heart can do that. And my Sioux uncle, my adopted Sioux uncle, Linda's of mine, once told me tonska Nephew, the longest journey you're going to make in your life is from here to here. People in the new age have heard that creating authentic power is taking the journey. That's the work, that's the decision, choice by choice, your life will always bring you to circumstances that require a decision, and you will always make it love or fear. In other words, you don't need to control your life. You can let your life take you where it will and it will. What you are responsible for are your choices. When you come to a choice point, which would be to speak, not to speak, to act in anger or to act with understanding, to forgive or to hate. That is a choice point that is not given to you. The choice is inherent in the earth school. This is a domain of duality. For every this, there's a that, and you must choose and you will.

51:46

I find that there are many paradoxes. That's how I might take on it, that there are many paradoxes, and

51:53

This is just a beginning Jannecke. Paradox simply is one way of your beginning to see and experience the limitation of your intellect, the new consciousness. The new consciousness is not comprehensible by your intellect. It cannot grasp or articulate the new consciousness. Instead, there is emerging a higher order of logic and understanding of the heart that tan and beyond that are consciousnesses even more expensive, but leave behind your understanding of what is Understanding my as I have been on my journey, my teachers would tell me things like a rest here, Gary, your intellect has reached a stopping point, but you have not.

52:53

And I can recognize that in myself that I'm listening to this from very many different perspectives in myself, as the viewer. I'm asking questions from my mind, but I'm listening also from my heart, understanding what you're saying in a way, and that's interesting to experience that so many parts of me are alive at the same time.

53:16

Yes, isn't that interesting? And I'd suggest that if we have another conversation like this, now that you've asked questions from your mind, make the next set of questions from your heart. That's where the interesting energy is. That's where the transformation can occur.

53:38

That's true. And at the same time, I want to be a bridge between those who are not there yet and those who are there yet, because people often come and say to me, I don't understand what you're talking about. And could you make

53:52

Use your experiences as you're using them now, at first, I never said this is what is from my perspective, I would say this is what I've been taught. Because when I first began to learn these things, I rejected them. I said my limited knowledge of them at the time. And I said, No, I don't want to be a part of any dogma. We've got too many now. And my teacher suggested, then don't that you can say to people, this is a window through which you've come to see life, and you offer it to them and see if it's helpful for them to look through this window also. And that's what I've done for almost 40 years, Janica, if I ever say this is the way the universe is, and I know that someone can say rightfully, wait a minute. You didn't include our Lord Jesus Christ. Wait a minute. What about the Buddha? He's the one who became enlightened. What about Krishna? Know, and I know that they're right. I didn't say those things, and yet I said, this is the way the universe is. So I never say that, because I don't know enough to say that. All I know is from my limited perspective, which is this incarnation as Gary zukov in the air of school. And it's very small, but I can say this is my experience, and no one can argue that, no one ever

55:30

I love that perspective, and the way I see it after all these interviews is that it's all true from a perspective, like from a higher perspective, like Truth is truth from a perspective. So we all just see different angles and different sort of ways in or we have one, one piece of the big puzzle?

55:53

Right. Jannecke, we're coming to close to the end of our time. So I want to suggest this that also is a choice. What do you choose? What do you choose? There's such a richness here. There's Christianity, there's Buddhism, there's Hinduism, there's Baha'i, there's Eckhart, Gary Deepak, who's right? There's your teachers. Are they right? You choose. There is no path waiting for you to discover it that you can get on and then follow it to your goal. You create it, moment by moment, you are a powerful and creative, compassionate and loving spirit, and the new consciousness is moving us in that direction, and that direction is toward love.

56:46

Powerful. Garry, this has been highly interesting to speak with you today, and I want to ask you one final question, maybe the biggest of them all, what is the deeper meaning of life from your perspective love you are.

57:02

There's no deeper meaning apart from you. Follow your meaning. That's how you create authentic power. Leave your intellect behind. Don't use that as a beacon anymore. That doesn't mean that you can't use it. I know what my zip code and what my passwords are, some of them, that's why I have a password manager. But I know how to I know how to activate that. Follow your meaning, your meaning of someone else's meaning. Let that be your guide. Let that be your North Star. Or if you're in the southern hemisphere, let that be your yourself star, the and also, I would like to say, we have conversations much like this once a month. We call it an evening with Gary Zukav, and I invite you and all the people who are listening to us to join that and to come to our website, which is the name of the book, the seat of the soul, S, C, A, T of the S, O, U, l.com, and see if there's anything there that supports you. I feel there will be. That's my intention. But again, it's an offering. It's a suggesting, suggestion. I love being with you. Jannecke, thank you so much for inviting me.

58:24

Thank you so much Gary

58:25

I love being with the people with who are listening to us. Because if you're still listening by now, you're listening with your heart. You may think, no, I'm listening with a critical part of my mind. Yes, but if you're still listening, you're still listening. Look at what your important decisions are and explore them.

58:46

Thank you, and thank you for your amazing work, for your amazing books, and this was just wonderful. Thank you for going along on the ride with me, with all my thoughts around here and there. I love that it, It was such an honor to speak with you so thank you so much.

59:04

You are welcome Jannecke,